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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
this would be of interest to me, no need to get out plug the car into a wall box at home


just have one of these in the driveway , park the car up in the right place and go in doors and the car will quietly get on with charging itself


Qualcomm and Ricardo sign commercial wireless EV charging licence agreement - Ricardo


only down side would be you would have to park your car in the same spot every time, bit of a pain if two or more cars use the driveway
 

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I assume power would be lost during the charging process since you're not directly charging the battery through a port. Not worth the money (probably costs more than traditional charger) and it's not hard to plug in an electric vehicle. I personally wouldn't get one, coudl end up taking longer to charge the car than just plugging it in.
 

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That would be what I would be worried about. How quickly can it charge and how strong would that charge be. I rather take an extra less than 5 minutes to get it plugged in.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
reading the write up charge is about 85% efficient so you do lose some power in the process.


I think not having to leave an obvious cable vulnerable to vandalism / damage is a benefit, I can potentially see more of these being fitted at services or supermarkets to cut down on repair costs due to damaged sockets etc but for this an increase in power transfer rate would probably be required


if it is a case of park the car up for he night, increasing charge times from 4.5 hours to about 6 hours is not an issue, you should still be able to plug into fast chargers on services and supermarkets as well


this is a relatively new tech so will improve and currently not ready for prime time deployments, so I will watch and wait
 

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Then there's weather and over time exposed to various weather conditions it could cause a wired system to wear over time and maybe not work well in some conditions, wireless solves all those problems.
 

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Wireless charging for BEV and PHEVs is probably the worst idea ever associated with these cars. It is neither practical nor safe. Would you defeat the safety interlock on your microwave oven and operate it with the door open? Wireless charges operate at multiples of the power of your microwave oven. The charger would be a huge safety hazard to pets and small children that might get near the charger. Wireless charging is grossly wasteful of electric power. Each charge would waste kilowatts(!) of power. Since wireless charging is operating a very high-power transmitter right in your garage, it would interfere with any wireless communications within a wide area--interfering not only with all your wireless devices but all your neighbors too. It's just a huge fail of an idea and I sincerely hope it never gets any traction, but I see it promoted all the time.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 · (Edited)
it would not be on all the time so no massive waste of power, there would be about a 15% loss in power transfer partly in the electronics to drive the coils, partly from the leakage of the magnetic field used to transfer the power, and similar to wired systems the car would trigger the start of charging by a "handshake" type protocol, i.e. the car would emit a low power signal so the charger realised there was something to be charged, they would exchange information between them to set charge rate etc then the charging would begin and like a wired charger the current would gradually be reduced as the battery was charged


as to danger for pets, wildlife and children would be no different than power lines and you see birds sat on them all the time without them disappearing into a puff of smoke and feathers


this would not have the same issues as a microwave, as a microwave is designed to work at the resonant frequency of water molecules, wireless charging wold work at a much lower frequency and the design of the transmitter and receiver coils would limit the leakage of magnetic and RF fields etc to safe levels


as to interfering with wireless devices, I doubt it would be any more interfering than the powerline network plugs you can get to extend your wifi indoors


bottom line no need for a tin foil hat if your neighbour gets one of these
 

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These are meant to be installed inside a garage so there's no fear of vandalism anyways no matter which one you get. Safety aside, you're just losing energy when it's only 85% efficient. Electric cars already takes a while to charge, why prolong that?
 

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bluecar1, I stand by my statements (except that it would waste kwh not kw). I can't find any specs for frequency of the transmission between the tx and rx antennas on the Halo system, but it has to be high frequency judging from the size of the antennas and they would never be able to direct the energy if the frequency wasn't very high. The energy of electromagnetic radiation is directly proportional to it's frequency E=hv (h is planck's constant, v is freq.) This is where your bird on a power line analogy breaks down. A power line isn't designed to concentrate and direct EM energy. An antenna does. Power line freq. is 50hz or 60 hz. The Halo charger would have to operate in the MHz or GHz region to be effective. That's much higher energy than line freq. energy and much more dangerous.

The Qualcomm people say it's just like charging your toothbrush only higher power (only?!). Their analogy breaks down because the power transfer between toothbrush and charger is very efficient. The distance between the two is only a few mm. Also, the radiated power is radiated in one direction only--torroidally toward the rx coil. Finally, the power transferred is on the order of milliwatts so we don't care that much about the power radiated into space. It's not a danger and it's not going to interfere with communciations. In contrast, there are many inches between the Halo tx and rx antennas so a great percentage of the energy will be radiated into space. The Halo antenna will radiate upward toward the rx antenna and downward into the ground--not nearly as efficient as the torroidal toothbrush transfer. Finally, the power transferred is on the order of kilowatts (!) So we care a great deal about the power radiated to space.

The Qualcomm Halo people are grant money scammers hocking their dangerous fraudware to nitwits in government agencies that have no understanding of RF. It angers me that they're stealing public money, but it really scares me that they want to put this system in roads. There, it would be a radiation hazard not only to the BEV but to people in adjacent lanes as well.
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
apparently the QUALCOMM system has been or is being adopted by merc and bmw to avoid all the issues with range of plug types with current wired systems


the article article in the current (august) CAR mag today in the supermarket, filled in a few gaps


apparently the car talks to the system via wireless, it is designed for a optimum 140mm gap between car and pad, the diagram in the article seems to show the car mounted coil under the engine, and there are radar type sensors for detecting pets etc current power transfer rate is 3.6KW
 

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Thanks for the link, bluecar1. It's another article, like so many others, that's written by someone that doesn't understand or care about the problems associated with such charging systems. Namely:

1. They're not safe.
2. They're grossly inefficient.
3. They will cause RF interference.

but then I repeat myself.

I would never have such a system in my house and if my neighbor got one, I'd hire a lawyer and sue him to have it removed. If my city govt or other govt proposed putting such systems in the roads, I'd form a group "Scientists and Engineers Against Hi-Power Transmission of EM Radiation" or some such name, and we'd be in the faces of the bureaucrats proposing such lunacy. If people can mobilize against cell phone towers, which transmit only a watt or so of power and aren't remotely an EM radiation safety hazard, surely we can mobilize against wireless hi-power charging systems that transmit kw and certainly are an EM radiation hazard.

But I'm betting that these systems will remain pie-in-the-sky vaporware and will try not to get upset.
 

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In the US, the FCC governs the airwaves. The FCC's position regarding EM radiation safety, generally, is that if the EM field power is not so strong that it boils the eyes out of your skull or explodes your nutsack it's safe. (I'm not kidding). Nevertheless, I found this field document of theirs, "Evaluating Compliance with FCC Guidelines for Human Exposure to Radiofrequency Electromagnetic Fields". On pg 13 and 14 they say they want a 1kw antenna at least 10 M off the ground (2kw limit for broadband PCS antennas) or they need to come out for a field evaluation where they actually measure field strength and do maximum permissible exposure calculations.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Wireless Car Charging - Motoring, Top Stories - The Asian Today Online


Mercedez Benz Set To Unveil Wireless Charging In The S-Class By Next Year


looks like it is going into the wild very shortly,


so long as they use proper sine wave (to minimise harmonics) on a specific licensed frequency there should be minimal interference to existing services, the question of EM radiation I am not sure


NMR scanners in hospitals use very large magnetic fields with no danger to the patients who are actually inside the field, so I don't see that as being a big problem, as nobody should be subjected to the field


no doubt this will take several more years for certification and testing, before appearing in the wild, all it is really is a transformer without an iron core to guide the magnetic fields, EM radiation should be minimal as not aerial just the coils, biggest thing will be the frequency it operated at
 

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The only problem I see with this Qualcomm system is that it is going to be a hassle to park the car right in the center of the wireless charger. Apparently the receiver and transmitter coils still need to be aligned perfectly to start charging. So it will probably be a while anyways before we see anything remotely consumer friendly.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
yep currently only V1.0 systems not ready for prime time in the consumer market, but give them a few years for the tech to mature and we might see something better


I like the idea of not having to plug cables in etc (less risk of theft of cable, vandalisation of charge points etc) but currently the positioning is to critical for good charging
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
just come across this one

Report: Audi A8L Introduces Wireless Charging » AutoGuide.com News

The plug-in version of the A8L will be Audi’s first car to use wireless inductive charging instead of a power cord.

Owners and chauffeurs alike will be able to simply drive over a charging pad that automatically charges the A8L plug-in’s batteries.
The extra-cost option puts a coil under the A8L’s front axle. When the car drives over the charging plate, it rises up until it’s within a few fractions of an inch from the coil and starts charging the batteries, which are good enough to drive the car for about 30 miles on their own.
Now, if that sounds a little tricky, lining something under car up with something even more under the car, don’t worry because Audi has thought of that, too. When you’re ready to charge, the display screen helps you to find the charging plate.

Together, the electric motor and 3.0-liter gasoline engine combine to produce 442 hp and 516 lb-ft of torque, sending power to all four wheels.
Theoretically, the powertrain could be made available on the standard wheelbase A8, but a spokesperson told Digital Trends that its wider availability will depend on demand.
And given its self-parking capabilities, it doesn’t take much imagination to envision a future in which an electrified Audi will go find its own charging bay, that it could then vacate when charged.
Back here in the realm of reality, though, the plug-in A8 should hit showrooms next year.
 

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Nikki on the Transport Evolved YouTube channel has been using a wireless charger to charge their Leaf. I'm not sure which video it's covered in, but I've seen in in their garage shots.

Link to long term review:
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
seems BMW are first to market

https://www.greencarreports.com/new...lug-in-car-with-wireless-charging-this-summer

BMW 530e will be first "plug-in" car with wireless charging this summer

2018 BMW 530e iPerformance wireless charging

When will charging your electric car be as convenient as charging your phone?
This summer, if BMW has its way. The company says it will be the first to lease a wireless inductive charging system in the U.S. for its 530e plug-in hybrid. Customers can order the system now, and BMW says it will be delivered in Europe starting in July and that it should roll out to American customers by the end of 2018.

The system consists of two parts, a wireless charging Ground Pad that plugs into a wall in a customer's garage, and a wireless receiver Car Pad mounted to the underside of the front of the car.

When a driver pulls into his or her garage, the car will connect with the Ground Pad and display a bird's-eye view of the car and the Ground Pad on the car's central display. Guide lines on the screen that show the front of the car (just like rearview camera lines), to help the driver place the car over the pad. A graphic confirmation appears on the screen when the car is centered correctly over the target.
 

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