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I think those of you who wrote that the model 3 will be a serious impediment to Ioniq 5 success are correct. In the US there's a great tax incentive to buy a new model like the Ioniq 5, and the Model 3, has already sold so many, that the federal tax incentive dried up for that model. The problem I've observed is, auto makers like Hyundai jack up their prices to 'soak up' that tax incentive for themselves. IF Hyundai does that with the Ioniq 5, and the stickers come in the the mid $50s, I will be buying a NEW Model 3 OR a CPO Ioniq 5 when they come back from lease. The 28kW 2019 Ioniq I just bought with 13.7k miles was only $17k plus tax... WELL UNDER the sticker price in the low $30s... Resale value is not stellar IMO... and consider what the 'trade in' value would have been on my car when it came back from lease.
 

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I think those of you who wrote that the model 3 will be a serious impediment to Ioniq 5 success are correct… The 28kW 2019 Ioniq I just bought with 13.7k miles was only $17k plus tax... WELL UNDER the sticker price in the low $30s... Resale value is not stellar IMO...
Teslas do have very good resale value.
 

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Teslas do have very good resale value.
I totally agree... the Tesla's resale values are very good... 'so good' that it doesn't make sense to buy a used one... I don't know how they do it. Perhaps it's because they only 'build to order' and people have to wait 2-8 weeks to get a new Tesla, so impatient (and dumb) people are willing to pay 'too much' for a used one. Toyota Tacoma trucks hold their value really well also... I bought a 2015 certified pre-owned Tacoma TRD Sport in 2018 and these darn trucks are expensive, even used.
 

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US resale values can be distorted by the federal tax credit. A new Ioniq with an MSRP of $33k is eligible for the full $7500 tax credit, making it effectively $25,500. Since used cars are not able to get this credit, the Ioniq depreciates $7500 immediately after being purchased. This makes most EVs depreciate much more than a traditional vehicle. Tesla doesn’t see this effect because they aren’t eligible for the tax credit (among other reasons of supply, popularity...).
 

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I think you're totally wrong about the Ioniq 38/28 have 'very strong residual' values... I'm in CA and I bought my 2019 CPO 28kW Ioniq EV for $17k plus tax... I think the sticker on it was over $32k... that's some pretty brutal depreciation.
That's not the story here in the UK. Used Ioniq values are very strong.



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Last week I test drove a Volvo XC40 recharge EV... it's an SUV and IMO, will compete directly with the Ioniq 5 and KIA EV6... Here's what I just got via email regarding this SUV:
"The Volvo XC40 Recharge pure electric starts at $58,750 MSRP and may qualify for a $7,500 federal tax credit. Additional local tax credits or benefits may be available."​
Fully loaded I think the sticker comes in around the low $60s. It's a very nice car. I hope the Ioniq 5 comes in below these prices but I wouldn't be surprised if they come in around the same price range as this Volvo. I think the better warranty and better instrumentation will make the Ioniq/KIA product the way I will go, but IF they come in too high, Tesla resale value could make me go Tesla when I get my next EV. I think 2022 will be an exciting time for EV buyers and 2025 a GREAT time to buy a certified preowned EV.
 

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US resale values can be distorted by the federal tax credit. A new Ioniq with an MSRP of $33k is eligible for the full $7500 tax credit, making it effectively $25,500. Since used cars are not able to get this credit, the Ioniq depreciates $7500 immediately after being purchased. This makes most EVs depreciate much more than a traditional vehicle. Tesla doesn’t see this effect because they aren’t eligible for the tax credit (among other reasons of supply, popularity...).
I agree... 2 things don't make sense to me... #1, not everyone will qualify for the $7.5k tax credit, so it's not a good idea to 'count on that' when you buy one... #2 since most of us finance a car, it makes very little sense (for me) to finance a tax credit, and pay interest for a 'possible benefit' on tax return I won't file until the year after I buy the car. These are 2 reasons among many, I went with a certified preowned Hyundai instead of a new one.
 

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I agree... 2 things don't make sense to me... #1, not everyone will qualify for the $7.5k tax credit, so it's not a good idea to 'count on that' when you buy one... #2 since most of us finance a car, it makes very little sense (for me) to finance a tax credit, and pay interest for a 'possible benefit' on tax return I won't file until the year after I buy the car. These are 2 reasons among many, I went with a certified preowned Hyundai instead of a new one.
Agreed. I’ve seen a lot of people confused about how the credit works online and I worry some of them might not get what they expected. Buying a new EV towards the end of the year is a good way to make sure you have enough income to earn the full credit. As for financing, I would hope that people pay off part of the loan using the credit. I doubt many do.
 

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Last week I test drove a Volvo XC40 recharge EV... it's an SUV and IMO, will compete directly with the Ioniq 5 and KIA EV6... Here's what I just got via email regarding this SUV:
"The Volvo XC40 Recharge pure electric starts at $58,750 MSRP and may qualify for a $7,500 federal tax credit. Additional local tax credits or benefits may be available."​
Fully loaded I think the sticker comes in around the low $60s. It's a very nice car. I hope the Ioniq 5 comes in below these prices but I wouldn't be surprised if they come in around the same price range as this Volvo. I think the better warranty and better instrumentation will make the Ioniq/KIA product the way I will go, but IF they come in too high, Tesla resale value could make me go Tesla when I get my next EV. I think 2022 will be an exciting time for EV buyers and 2025 a GREAT time to buy a certified preowned EV.
There is every reason to expect that the I5 will top out fully loaded at or below that level. It's also worth noting that their pricing is not expected to be that far off from the ID.4. It's just that the short range battery won't be available here, and theoretically it's a more capable vehicle so it will most definitely top out higher for the upper trim(s). But every indication we have suggests it will be priced in the general vicinity of the ID.4/Mach E. The EV6 is thought to be a touch more expensive, but this is all speculation of course.

The comparison against the Model Y is the one that is going to keep coming up by nature of the Model Y essentially being the reference model in the segment. Assuming the range tops out a bit over the Model Y LR, that's a strategic error to be sure, but the comparison isn't really that clear cut. We tend to think of tesla as being inherently the best, but Tesla's dominating position in the market is almost entirely due to being the first company to really commit themselves to that market. Most models until now have been compliance models, or developmental/experimental models. Tesla also has a history of poor initial quality and has very particular design practices that aren't for everyone. Why shouldn't we expect a diverse range of other serious efforts (such as the ID.4, Mach E, Ioniq 5, EV6, Nissan Ariya, etc) to eat up a good chunk of market share (especially because as long as Tesla's don't qualify for the federal tax credit, They're almost always going to be significantly more expensive in practice).
 

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There is every reason to expect that the I5 will top out fully loaded at or below that level. It's also worth noting that their pricing is not expected to be that far off from the ID.4. It's just that the short range battery won't be available here, and theoretically it's a more capable vehicle so it will most definitely top out higher for the upper trim(s). But every indication we have suggests it will be priced in the general vicinity of the ID.4/Mach E. The EV6 is thought to be a touch more expensive, but this is all speculation of course.

The comparison against the Model Y is the one that is going to keep coming up by nature of the Model Y essentially being the reference model in the segment. Assuming the range tops out a bit over the Model Y LR, that's a strategic error to be sure, but the comparison isn't really that clear cut. We tend to think of tesla as being inherently the best, but Tesla's dominating position in the market is almost entirely due to being the first company to really commit themselves to that market. Most models until now have been compliance models, or developmental/experimental models. Tesla also has a history of poor initial quality and has very particular design practices that aren't for everyone. Why shouldn't we expect a diverse range of other serious efforts (such as the ID.4, Mach E, Ioniq 5, EV6, Nissan Ariya, etc) to eat up a good chunk of market share (especially because as long as Tesla's don't qualify for the federal tax credit, They're almost always going to be significantly more expensive in practice).
I agree with everything you said except " as long as Tesla's don't qualify for the federal tax credit, They're almost always going to be significantly more expensive in practice)." Tesla lowers the price of their cars the instant they no longer qualify for the tax credit. Just like the 'market' corrects (via depreciation) for cars that 'were new' and now are registered to a new owner. I've heard that the US 'may' consider extending the tax credits beyond the current first 200,000 units of an EV model sold... if this becomes tax law you can bet your last dollar Tesla will pump up their prices to soak up that tax credit so fast, our heads will spin. I think tax credits 'go to the dealer or manufacturer' not to the consumer by virtue of the higher sticker price and market demand that these tax incentives create. That's why the lease deals are so attractive, the tax credit goes to the lessor not the lessee. The tax credit is also not a 'refundable' credit... this means the tax payer has to 'owe' $7,500 in taxes in order to qualify for the credit in full. I don't know about you folks, but I plan for and pay my tax preparer a pretty penny to make sure I don't owe that much. If it was a refundable tax credit, I would be all over a new car like white on rice.
 

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As Motor-Man has said on his Youtube page, Hyundai is a "metal manufacture distinguished as a car company," they also make food, underwear, and other items according to a friend I have in Korea. This all translates that they have multiple resources at their disposal and seem to build their cars very effectively. However, the cost of batteries is still very expensive in which the customer ends up paying more for an EV. As soon as the price of batteries goes down, Hyundai will be one of the few that will deliver a great product at a terrific price.
Hyundai also own Boston Dynamics, arguably the most advanced robotics/AI company in the world.
 

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Hi Nanda, It’s a better car (technology and design-wise) than the ID4, so expect it to cost a bit more. Prices for the US have not been released yet.
Sadly, VW was responsible for paying the bill and designing the layout for Electrify America, yet the ID.4
I think you're totally wrong about the Ioniq 38/28 have 'very strong residual' values... I'm in CA and I bought my 2019 CPO 28kW Ioniq EV for $17k plus tax... I think the sticker on it was over $32k... that's some pretty brutal depreciation.
:cry:
 

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I agree with everything you said except " as long as Tesla's don't qualify for the federal tax credit, They're almost always going to be significantly more expensive in practice)." Tesla lowers the price of their cars the instant they no longer qualify for the tax credit. Just like the 'market' corrects (via depreciation) for cars that 'were new' and now are registered to a new owner. I've heard that the US 'may' consider extending the tax credits beyond the current first 200,000 units of an EV model sold... if this becomes tax law you can bet your last dollar Tesla will pump up their prices to soak up that tax credit so fast, our heads will spin. I think tax credits 'go to the dealer or manufacturer' not to the consumer by virtue of the higher sticker price and market demand that these tax incentives create. That's why the lease deals are so attractive, the tax credit goes to the lessor not the lessee. The tax credit is also not a 'refundable' credit... this means the tax payer has to 'owe' $7,500 in taxes in order to qualify for the credit in full. I don't know about you folks, but I plan for and pay my tax preparer a pretty penny to make sure I don't owe that much. If it was a refundable tax credit, I would be all over a new car like white on rice.
Let's split the difference. In practical terms, the Model Y is priced higher (in the us) than it's most significant competitors (ID.4, Mach E), particularly when you account for the incentive. If the I5 tops out at ~55k, it's real world price will thus be ~47.5k. (It gets weirder once you count state incentives. I live in CT, which has a useless incentive program that is only really useful if you want a Bolt/Kona type thing, because of an arbitrary 42k MSRP limit). Now, things will definitely get weird if the federal government does widen out the federal incentive to include tesla again. Would tesla raise their prices? Would other manufacturers lower theirs to try to compete? Probably a bit of both (and considering the price of the Model Y has risen by like $2500 in the last few months, I don't really put anything past tesla. But Elon Musk is also an unmitigated lunatic, so that's not really a surprise)
 

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Model Y costs 52k with a 326 mile range, more or less proven in terms of technology. Ioniq 5 is a newbie with a brand new platform. Even for that matter, ID4 has been around and somewhat people know it with all it's flaws (software glitches). Am not sure if it's worth if it costs anywhere over 42k. In relative terms, Hyundai is still an underdog compared to Toyota/Honda etc.

Actually they are quite far ahead in the EV design /build, would not necessarily agree with you but to date reviews on Ioniq 5 have been very promising but I don't thinnk you will see $42 as it will cost more the the Kona EV currently out although I do not know what that price is in US currency
 

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Discussion Starter · #36 ·
I think you're totally wrong about the Ioniq 38/28 have 'very strong residual' values... I'm in CA and I bought my 2019 CPO 28kW Ioniq EV for $17k plus tax... I think the sticker on it was over $32k... that's some pretty brutal depreciation.
28KW sounds too low , but I think its a good deal to buy a car to run errands within 40 miles.. dropping kids, groceries and other stuff.
 

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I totally agree... the Tesla's resale values are very good... 'so good' that it doesn't make sense to buy a used one... I don't know how they do it. Perhaps it's because they only 'build to order' and people have to wait 2-8 weeks to get a new Tesla, so impatient (and dumb) people are willing to pay 'too much' for a used one. Toyota Tacoma trucks hold their value really well also... I bought a 2015 certified pre-owned Tacoma TRD Sport in 2018 and these darn trucks are expensive, even used.
Jeeps command the best resale from what I have seen period outside of Tesla. I believe Tesla does so well on resale because in reality they are the best EV currently and software/charge wise they are ahead so most probably think why settle for less, its proven and been around the longest, I can understand that and if the Ioniq 5 does not price out where I need it my choice will be between an ID.4 and a Tesla Model 3
 

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Jeeps command the best resale from what I have seen period outside of Tesla. I believe Tesla does so well on resale because in reality they are the best EV currently and software/charge wise they are ahead so most probably think why settle for less, its proven and been around the longest, I can understand that and if the Ioniq 5 does not price out where I need it my choice will be between an ID.4 and a Tesla Model 3
I think free permanent access to the Supercharger network is a powerful factor keeping the prices of older Model S cars.
 

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I think free permanent access to the Supercharger network is a powerful factor keeping the prices of older Model S cars.
I agree... I've looked at used Model S cars and if the miles are low they're attractive. Buying a used car without a warranty scares me though... and Tesla CPO cars are only $5k leass than a new one... which makes me think Model 3 is the way I would go, if I go with Tesla. The reason I made the 2019 Ioniq 28kW my first EV was the low, LOW price AND the CPO warranty. My Ioniq car only had about 13.7k miles on it when I drove it off the lot, so I still have the 'bumper to bumper' warranty and powertrain warranty up to 100k miles I believe. That's some damn good 'sh!t' for $17k plus tax. I have a 110 miles round trip commute Mo-Fr and I can charge at home up to 85% and go round trip OR use any one of 3 FREE charges within 1.2 miles of work and get my 'juice for free'... or at least most of my juice for free. Compared to the $320 a month I was spending on premium for my Acura TL, that's unbelievable.

I took it for a 5k service to Les Schwab tires at 20k miles... they did the tire inspection, tire rotation, break inspection and I checked my own coolant level... they found a nail in my tire and I got all of this for the unbelievably low price of FREE as well. When your car has new, original factory installed tires they do this for free to earn your biz later. The dealer quoted about $250 for this 20k mile service o_O... that sounds like a rip off to me. IF this car goes 100k miles with no serious problems I may just keep it to see how far it can go, but I will also buy something better, like Tesla, I5, EV6 or perhaps a Volvo or some other EV... I'll keep my Toyota Tacoma for hauling and as a backup, though. They're such great trucks.
 
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