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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
full article at
Love for diesels exhausted by emissions scandals | Carbuyer


Exclusive survey finds negative media coverage has swayed 61% of consumers away from diesel cars




A survey by Carbuyer has found reports on the subject of diesel emissions have put almost two-thirds of consumers off the idea of a diesel car.
The exclusive survey, which ran on Carbuyer.co.uk and social media, was answered by over 1,100 people. Of those, 61% said they had been put off buying a diesel car, 33% said they’d been unaffected by negative stories while 6% weren’t aware of any news.
Our research tallies with figures from the Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders (SMMT) showing diesel sales down 9.2% in February 2017 compared with February 2016. Sales of alternative-fuel vehicles such as hybrids and battery-powered cars, meanwhile, were up 48.9% over the same period.

wonder how many will turn to Ioniq's :)


note to Hyundai
time to step up production and get quicker ships, or start producing them in Europe to reduce shipping times
 

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I must admit. I loved my BMW but wanted to get away from diesel. So here I am with a lovely if not slow Ioniq.
 

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But the father in law had an Auris and now more recently the new Prius. Even Toyota have 3 month or so lead times on their hybrids as he has had to wait for his in both instances
 

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Great news! Especially With the current rise of climate change deniers... again... hopefully people will do their own research and figure it out in the end.
 

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Great news! Especially With the current rise of climate change deniers... again... hopefully people will do their own research and figure it out in the end.
At the end of the day green credentials for most people (me included if I am honest) come down to how much it costs you....I do my bit but if the green option is vastly more expensive I prob wont do it....I didnt class the Ioniq as vastly more expensive :)

It will still take a while tough...you only have to look at all the parents who sit outside schools with their engines running to power their heaters or aircon depending on the time of year, merrily pumping diesel fumes into their childrens lungs! (I DONT inlcude myself in THAT bracket!)

I am swapping from my focus diesel to the Ioniq alos
 

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Great news! Especially With the current rise of climate change deniers... again... hopefully people will do their own research and figure it out in the end.
As far as climate change is concerned, a modern, downsized diesel isn't bad at all. On an intercity motorway where high speed is legal (130 km/h in France, 140 km/h in Italy, faster in Germany), a modern diesel will produce less CO2 than a petrol-hybrid.
What made me switch from diesel to the Ioniq is not climate-change but local health damage: risks of cancer, asthma and pneumonia induced by diesel fumes, especially NOx and fine particles. Bluntly speaking, diesel doesn't warm the planet up - diesel just kills people.
 

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Don't I know it.. i work in radiotherapy.. in our area alone we treat 200 people per day and it's on the increase...

As far as what warms the planet, it's a combination of things.. I'm sure the black plumes of smoke that fill the sky from the bombing, burned out oil fields or accidental fires like the waste plant in Stoke recently, doesn't help either. But we're getting rather off topic now ;)
 

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if you look a modern GDi petrol engine is nearly as bad as a diesel for pm5 / pm10 fine particles (byproduct of the fuel burns when direct injected at extreme pressure) but nowhere near as much NOx or CO2

Hyundai i30 1.6 CRDi 136ch Creative : 102g CO2/km

Hyundai i30 1.4 T-GDi 120ch Creative : 115g CO2/km
Hyundai i30 1.4 T-GDi 140ch Creative : 124g CO2/km

So, as far as CO2 and global warming are concerned, non-hybrid diesel is clearly better than non-hybrid petrol, isn't it?

Regarding particles, my understanding is that GDi is as bad or even worse than diesel regarding micro-particles (PM 2.5?) but much better regarding small particles (PM 10). But I don't have any data on hand to support that.
 

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I notice the smell of other cars so much more now as well... so gross :(
 

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Hyundai i30 1.6 CRDi 136ch Creative : 102g CO2/km

Hyundai i30 1.4 T-GDi 120ch Creative : 115g CO2/km
Hyundai i30 1.4 T-GDi 140ch Creative : 124g CO2/km

So, as far as CO2 and global warming are concerned, non-hybrid diesel is clearly better than non-hybrid petrol, isn't it?

Regarding particles, my understanding is that GDi is as bad or even worse than diesel regarding micro-particles (PM 2.5?) but much better regarding small particles (PM 10). But I don't have any data on hand to support that.
I think a big problem with the diesels here is that VW (and other manufacturers ?) were cheating massively on the CO2 emissions on their diesel cars. They were programmed to pass the emissions tests, but once they're actually driving normally, their emissions go up a lot.
 

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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
there was actually 2 issues with diesel


1:- the dieselgate issue which was the emission control systems for reducing NOx had the cheat code in to minimise NOx at testing the pretty much thurn them off under normal running, meaning Diesels where pumping out masses of NOx causing issues like we are seeing in london (high NOx is a problem caused by high temperature combustion with a lean fuel mix)


2:- the gearbox and engines were so optimised to get the best fuel economy on the certification tests to minimise CO2 that during normal driving you couldn't get anywhere near the claimed MPG (which was achieved on test) so loads more CO2 than claimed


add to that the particulate filter and ad blue emmision controls system which are complex and costly when they go wrong, all of these are now causing people to realise how bad diesels are and driving people who car about polution / the environment away from diesel
 

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Hyundai i30 1.6 CRDi 136ch Creative : 102g CO2/km

Hyundai i30 1.4 T-GDi 120ch Creative : 115g CO2/km
Hyundai i30 1.4 T-GDi 140ch Creative : 124g CO2/km

So, as far as CO2 and global warming are concerned, non-hybrid diesel is clearly better than non-hybrid petrol, isn't it?

Regarding particles, my understanding is that GDi is as bad or even worse than diesel regarding micro-particles (PM 2.5?) but much better regarding small particles (PM 10). But I don't have any data on hand to support that.
Why bother with a diesel now, the current range of small turbo petrol engines will provide diesel levels of economy. Also a lot depends on your journey types, Diesels are terrible if you do lots of short journeys. We've had 3 diesels vehicle that have been noting but trouble because they were used on short journey's. The DPF filters got clogged and the Cat. doesn't work effectively either.
 

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there was actually 2 issues with diesel


1:- the dieselgate issue which was the emission control systems for reducing NOx had the cheat code in to minimise NOx at testing the pretty much thurn them off under normal running, meaning Diesels where pumping out masses of NOx causing issues like we are seeing in london (high NOx is a problem caused by high temperature combustion with a lean fuel mix)


2:- the gearbox and engines were so optimised to get the best fuel economy on the certification tests to minimise CO2 that during normal driving you couldn't get anywhere near the claimed MPG (which was achieved on test) so loads more CO2 than claimed


add to that the particulate filter and ad blue emmision controls system which are complex and costly when they go wrong, all of these are now causing people to realise how bad diesels are and driving people who car about polution / the environment away from diesel
The issue 1- is a diesel specific issue, and a big driver in my decision to ditch my diesel for an Ioniq. But the issue 2- is internal combustion engin specific, not diesel specific.

European fuel economy and CO2 measures are easy to turn around for all cars with an ICE, including petrol cars, and including hybrid cars. Mitsubishi was officially nailed for defrauding CO2 and fuel economy measures for its petrol cars, including the hybrid Outlander PHEV.

And my diesel car had the exact same fuel economy as the Ioniq, measured by actual fuel-ups.

Even full electric cars are not the answer to CO2 emissions and global warming in countries where power is produced by burning coal or heavy oil.

What I mean is that petrol-hybrid is overall better than diesel, which is why I bought one, but I don't want to massage myself into thinking hybrid cars will solve car-induced pollution.
 

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I had been looking for a replacement for my diesel Skoda Octavia for 18 months. I have had diesel cars for the past 20 years as they were the only real option for high mileage commuting at a lower cost to petrol cars. All of the cars that I had looked at were diesel SUVs but luckily the Ioniq came along just at the right time and was the only real choice particularly now that it looks like diesel cars in the UK are likely to be subject to additional taxes or even banned from some cities.
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
I do some pretty high mileage (done 12k since November) I was concerned I would not get the mpg on my longer runs as the information I found about hybrids suggested low speed town driving gave better mpg than motorway


but what I have found is it loves motorway runs as much as town, town driving does give slightly better mpg, but unlike a std car (petrol or diesel) when you get stuck in traffic on a motorway it flips to EV and don't use any fuel
 
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